RE: META: Singularity Action Group attempting to recruit SL4 members

From: Ben Goertzel (
Date: Mon Apr 28 2003 - 21:10:17 MDT

Hi Eliezer

I'm not going to get into a detailed argument on the merits or flaws of the
Singularity Action Group. (Or of the SIAI, which however I will say is a
much more mature and stable organization at this point.) But, well, you've
sucked me into saying a little more...

I like most of the people involved with SAG on a personal level, I enjoy
interacting with them, and I appreciate their enthusiasm for the Singularity
and for AGI. Frankly, I won't be shocked if something useful comes out of
the SAG, and I won't be shocked if it doesn't either.

Those internal SAG conversations that I have been exposed to [not a full
sample I'm sure], have pertained to topics such as what kinds of tools could
be created in the near term to aid AGI development in a relatively
AGI-design-independent way, and have not centered on SIAI or you or such
"political" topics at all. So, even if SAG did begin out of frustration
with SL4 or SIAI, it does not seem to me to be centered on that at present.

I note that I also booted Alan Grimes temporarily off my AGI list. And he
*really* had to work to earn that privilege, because I'm a really tolerant
list-master ;))

> Mike Deering thinks my life is
> an extended secret plot to infiltrate the most advanced AI
> projects, steal
> their secrets, and take over the world;

I take it you don't think this is accurate?? ;-)

> I strive to avoid sectarianism between serious groups worth taking
> seriously, for example, between ExI and WTA. But I would not wish to see
> the WTA extending tolerance to crackpot sects such as Raelianism in the
> name of "avoiding sectarianism". The Raelians are crackpots, and so are
> Alan Grimes and Mike Deering. I do not consider such to be included in
> the community of game-theoretical cooperators among whom tolerance is
> necessary. Such is *my* decision; take it as you will.

The Raelians are definitely on the wrong side of my personal "crackpot"
threshold! (Which is a very liberal threshold, because I really dislike
making harsh judgments of others.) While I aspire to be helpful to all
beings, sometimes one has to pick and choose, and I wouldn't choose to spend
time helping them unless they were about to be squashed by a meteor or
something! Fortunately, they don't seem interesting in dabbling in seed AI,
as least so far ...

-- Ben G

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