RE: Time and Minds/Big Daddy

From: Xavier Lumine (
Date: Sun Sep 23 2001 - 17:06:59 MDT

What I meant originally is,

"if you've been reading this list for months, and you are continuing to read
it, and you have an idea or topic which you think is beneficial to the list,
don't be afraid to post it for fear of ridicule"

don't let my figurative language confuse you into thinking that I have any
personal interest nor care as to who posts or who doesn't.

>From: "Aikin, Robert" <>
>To: "''" <>
>Subject: RE: Time and Minds/Big Daddy
>Date: Sun, 23 Sep 2001 14:50:05 -0500
>You may be deeply disturbed and frightened if you wish. However, I would
>suggest not letting my sarcasm push you into emotional despair. Rather,
>chew on this:
>The AI-to-SI theories propagated by SL4 and others are VERY interesting to
>wide spectrum of curious minds. Those who see Friendly AI as the next step
>in the human journey get a certain rush from such prospects. And there are
>others who are just as curious, but for other reasons. The so-called
>mainstream of Catholics, Protestant Christians, Orthodox and Conservative
>Jews and Muslims are not likely to share the trans-human/post-human
>enthusiasm, i.e., having machine intelligence replace human hierarchy, not
>to mention "God". The possibilities (even probabilities) of uploading
>humans, etc. surpasses the nightmares these folks share about "The End of
>Days" (at least in the biblical theory, God comes to the rescue). In a
>real fashion, AI <is> just that - THE END as defined by monotheism. Once
>better understood by the "moral majority" the theories behind the R&D of AI
>will likely be treated as the apotheosis if evil, an evil greater than
>abortion, euthanasia, adultery, materialism, and the like, combined.
>When the concepts are better understood by greater numbers, organized
>religion will be forced to study the available documents and determine an
>official position. This will have repercussions on many levels. The most
>obvious being the political level where AI R&D will suffer in one form or
>another under stricter "moral" guidelines. Where the Feds leave off, the
>religious zealots will pick-up. It is not too far-fetched to imagine
>of well-funded and connected "believers" hunting down and waging a very
>different kind of "holy war" on the scientists and proponents of AI (a holy
>war unlike the political/cultural being seen in the Muslim world/s, but one
>which unites human beings who "serve God" against the "blasphemers" who
>willing sell-out the human race [which, after all, it will be
>justified/rationalized, is created by the Holy One in His Image...really
>Their Image/s...but that's theological nitpicking]).
>This moment in time might very well be the proverbial good-old-days when
>folks could hunker-down on their work station and share their thoughts and
>dreams about AI without fear. For there may soon come a time when people
>are identified as either "serving The Lord" or "serving Satan" in the hunt
>to rid the race of traitors. Unless one is working behind the secured
>of a major corporate and/or government/military facility, a person may find
>him/herself in a world of sh*t, that is, at the mercy of folks who truly
>believe they are saving the human race from extinction.
>My understanding (don't get frightened here), as limited as it may be, is
>that a number of Bishops and Cardinals are currently reviewing the
>related to AI and "spiritual machines" and will be formulating an official
>response to the "dangers" of such research. A statement may be issued by
>Rome (to be followed by others elsewhere) within a year (they tend to move
>about as quickly as any government bureaucracy).
>In the beginning, there won't be much to worry about. Social movements
>(consider anti-abortionists as an example) take some time to organize...
>BTW, I'm getting back to work...not because "I'm unimportant", but because
>have a beautiful wife and precious daughter to support. Now if that
>distresses you, email me personally.
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Xavier Lumine []
>Sent: Sunday, September 23, 2001 11:36 AM
>Subject: RE: Time and Minds/Big Daddy
> >The brain power necessary for this will
> >probably find these words to be irritating. So I'll get back to my own
> >work.
> >
>I am deeply disturbed and frightened by this comment.
>I often find self-describing 'bystanders' posting on this list, following
>their often important thought with something along the lines of "but I'm no
>one to speak" or "I probably don't know what I'm talking about" or "I'm
>getting back to my work because the people who actually write AI will sneer
>at my post". The individuals on the Friendly AI project under the
>Singularity Institute for Artificial Intelligence are not superhuman. We
>a small team of computer programmers, self-educated cognitive scientists
>ethusiasts. Although I will not dispute that bright engineers and designers
>are necessary to create true Friendly AI, we are still people with an
>incomplete view of the world and posts to this list are not laffable nor
>I am always happy and interested to read the various essays and viewpoints
>posted here. Please, all future posters, do not terminate your messages
>"I'm getting back to work, I am unimportant" or something similar because
>that only causes me distress.
>Dmitriy Myshkin
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