Re: META: Memes and War [was: Tomorrow is a new day]

From: David Clark (
Date: Sat Nov 13 2004 - 13:03:54 MST

Response to "Keith Henson":

Now it seems *you* are the one lacking understanding. Your hypothesis was
that wars are caused by *war memes* that are caused by unequal distribution
of wealth. The result of this theory is that singularitarians must reduce
this uneven wealth distribution or we will be at war.

 I said *nothing* about the number of humans that could be maintained in
their environment in ancient history. I only said that people were widely
dispersed and there is no evidence that shows they contained a *war meme*.
I think they were too busy just surviving. The fact that the ancient
environment had many harsh pressures is *not* in dispute, only that there is
no evidence for a *war meme* in our fossil record. How is your *momma bear*
analogy relevant to proving a *war meme*? I have no problem believing that
all living creatures try to populate any given environment as much as the
conditions allow *but* why does that prove that one of those pressures was

 In fact your *war meme* hypothesis might be correct but you have not given
any good reasons why anyone should believe you.

> [Editorial note, I now am wondering if rejecting thinking about this
> subject might be due to _wired in_ censors

 I don't think I have "rejected thinking" about this topic at all. The fact
that I have responded to you should be *proof* of that!

> "Global maturing" may be a lot harder if censor biases keep us from
> thinking about this class of knowledge.

 I guess anyone who disagrees with you has to put up with being called
"immature". I think calling other people names is a sign of weakness!

> Human's generally don't have twins like bears, but in a primitive
> environment the typical woman is pregnant or nursing from late teens to
> early 40s.

 I was taught at University (in 2000) that historically, women started
having children at about 14 and lasted (lived) on average until about 20.
30 years old was considered almost ancient. Most men didn't make it past 20
years old. At least 50% of children didn't make it to their first birthday.
There was a cultural practice in South East Asia that a baby was only
considered human after they have reached the age of 1. If it died before
the age of 1, it was discarded in the trash like leftovers. The reason for
this was to minimize the grief of the mother and family because so many
babies died in there first year of life. Your facts don't seem to jive with
what I have studied.

 I put forward a theory of war that had to do with the perceived relative
weaknesses of countries. I have mentioned this twice before and you have
not even deigned to spend write one line in response. Why is it ok for you
to put forward a *controversial* theory and expect everyone to believe it
without any convincing evidence? Why so much hostility to the ideas of

 -- David Clark

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