Re: Zen singularity

From: Kevin (
Date: Mon Feb 23 2004 - 13:13:24 MST

> And yet most of these same people you're referring to [spiritual masters]
> routinely carry out conversations using words like "meditation", "fork",
> "toenail", "zen", and "compassion" -- words denoting concepts which they
> ALSO don't hold as being existent in any way, presumably...

Sure...the noumenal embodies all forms of manifestation without being
sullied in any way...

> I don't hold human concepts to have any absolute meaning, but yet, I use
> them in conversation anyway -- just as the "advanced humans" you're
> referring to use words denoting such concepts when they want to

But there's a major difference between your "not holding concepts to have
any absolute meaning" and what I was referring to. If I eat a Fershizzle pie
and describe it to you, you will have some concept of the pie, but you
really have no idea what it tastes like.

> [NOTE: I am certainly not claiming to be "advanced" in the same way that
> these people are. I'm just pointing out that you don't have to be so
> spiritually advanced to see these concepts as "unreal" and yet continue to
> use them anyway.]

I'm as unelightened as they come...At best I am a parrot for others grand

> And I suspect that AGI's will also experience a hell of a lot of other
> interesting kinds of truths and mind-states, which no human -- however
> spiritually advanced -- has ever touched (or will ever)

That's a bold statement to make. Especially considering you haven't
yourself even scratched the surface of your own depths (nor have I). The
experience of the beings I refer to is the penultimate(sp?) of Mind. This
Mind embodies all other minds and all phenonema, and therefore cannot be
superseeded, even by an AGI, or God or Buddha..

Nonetheless, mind states are infinite in variety, and to achieve different
mind states is no big deal. As far as "interesting kinds of truths"...thats
another matter, but there are relative truths and absolute truths. I have
no doubt that an AGI could achieve many relative truths that the smart
people on this planet have yet to discover. But absolute truth is called
absolute for a reason :)


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